Loren,

Your thoughts are correct, the terminology you are using I don’t agree with. Wisdom of crowds and social media are no where close to the same thing. Social media is not about asking opinions, advice and feedback.

It is just another marketing tool that brings people together with similar interests. Social media are sites like Digg, MySpace, Linkedin, etc. None of them asked users what they wanted before they built them. The founders knew what they wanted to do and they did it and were successful.

Don’t get eaten by a shark in Barbados.

By Cord Silverstein on Jan 31, 2007

Wow, Loren. You sound like you’re really mad. Chill out, dude–you’re going to fucking Barbados.

Why are those curtains always flapping?

By Vince Williams on Jan 31, 2007

I don’t know about them, Loren, but it sure gets my hormones racing to see you angry like that (even if you’re just acting) –it turns me on.

Is this the cosmic irony that all performance art pieces are supposed to have?

By Vince Williams on Jan 31, 2007

Fucking amazing post.

By Stephan Tual on Jan 31, 2007

Cord: Social media are sites like Digg, MySpace, Linkedin, etc. None of them asked users what they wanted before they built them.

Loren: They were successful at building shit aggregators that’s all. I never use any of those sites Cord.

Upper left of this page: “I’m Linkedin”

you’re so busy talking shit, you don’t even realize what an idiot you are.

By steve on Jan 31, 2007

joining to learn about it is one thing. putting it up there with all your other vitals is another. you’re pushing you’re involvement with it. you are a douche.

By steve on Jan 31, 2007

RE: shit aggregators

I see a LinkedIn button at the top left of your page.

Also, I agree with Cord, social media and wisdom of crowds are two different things. Lonely video bloggers don’t need the wisdom of crowds, but marketers do, and that’s who uses it the most anyway.

Social Media, imho, doesn’t even really exist as a subset of media. Everything is social now, we just expect it. Loren post thoughts, those thoughts are syndicated, we consume them…but since the web based social revolution we can now comment, trackback, link, forward, and extend the convo. That in no way means Loren has to consume our reaction to his thoughts and then re-evaluate them based on the aggregate “wisdom” of his audience. It just means we can pick up his ball and run with it (insert genital joke here).

I think ultimately, there is NOT alot of wisdom in crowds. But what crowds DO have is conversation, and it takes the wisdom of an INDIVIDUAL to dissect those conversations in order to get something useful. In theory, 3 wise individuals could extrapolate 3 different things from the same crowd, depending on their unique perspective and needs. Don’t forget we need to factor in the “client” (and yes, there is ALWAYS a client) who probably wants hear some magic words and the truly wise crowd monitoring individual will find ways to bend that wisdom to please his client in order to re-sign and start the expensive process all over again.

If crowds were so wise they would not need smart individuals. Perfect example: It took one person to come up with the wisdom of crowds idea, the crowd itself didnt even realize how “wise” they were. They couldn’t use their own wisdom even if they wanted to, it took a REAL wise person to figure this out and then in-turn share the idea with other wise people. Meanwhile, you’d think such a notion would empower crowds, but instead they remain zombies while real wise individuals cherry pick the “collective wisdom” for their own gains.

“Wisdom of crowds” is really just diluted insight that comes as a byproduct of social media. As media becomes more social there will be more crowds creating more conversations creating more valuable insight for wise marketers, authors, and stoned college professors.

Wait, what the fuck, should’nt I be working…FUCK!! DAMN YOU FELDMAN!!

By Bruce Prokopets on Jan 31, 2007

Agreed. And most of the people who participate in sites like Digg are there for their own promotional purposes. Similarly, very few stories would make it to the main page without some kind of manipulation — either gaming or ‘digg it’ buttons on the source page. The only exception is controversial Apple stories or Top 10 lists.

I’d say more than half of the stories on Digg aren’t really voted up by users. And it will get worse… much worse.

Eventually it’s going to be run entirely by the big players — folks like AOL’s Weblogs Inc who can get their stories to the front page using Digg It buttons. Now everyone is forced to use these tactics to just level the playing field.

It’s not social media at all.

By Nick on Jan 31, 2007

People will do anything for those who encourage their dreams, justify their failures, allay their fears, confirm their suspicions and help them throw rocks at their enemies.

This is how you USE the crowd.

By Jecklin on Jan 31, 2007

Why does Bruce make himself look so evil at his blog–a zombie slayer? Or a grandson of Vlad?

“Social media” sounds redundant to me. What kind of media isn’t social? It puts me in mind of a Time magazine schlock-piece.

By Vince Williams on Jan 31, 2007

Crowds are piss ants, with the ideology of a worm. This has been proven by social scientists.

The more people you lump together, the stupider the conversation gets.

MySpace is for horny teen girls who want old geezers to flirt with them in the guise of a Harry Potter Equus stud service. 60 million poor kids hawking their music to 60 million poor kids.

By vaspers the grate on Jan 31, 2007

Hilarious and incisive. A little hyperbole in there I think but that’s ok. People need to be smacked upside the head once in awhile.

I’m posting this on Multiply and I bet people will reply and tell me what an asshole you are. But they think I’m an asshole too so you’re in good company. (Or maybe not.)

By jvon on Jan 31, 2007

There is wisdom in the crowds. Just look at what the Nazis did or Jonestown or the Soviet Union.

By Jeremy Pepper on Jan 31, 2007

RE: Vince Williams-evil zombie bruce

I’m not evil. I smell like rotting flesh, but other than that I’m like a teddy bear…with guts hanging out.

After some google searcihng I just noticed that there is actually such a thing as “zombie marketing” and its more akin to spam and bullshit.

I am thinking about re-designing my blog because of it.

By Bruce Prokopets on Jan 31, 2007

Bruce, if you do the redesign, show us the real you.

By Vince Williams on Jan 31, 2007

Vince, when you say “real you” do you mean shirtless in my bedroom? or do you mean the t-shirt and jeans I wear to work? or do you mean the hostile and bitter employee?

Intersesting idea though. I’d like to know how many bloggers out there are as “real” as they can be. It’s odd because I link to my resume on my blog with no fear that the “zombie” look might turn a potential new employer off. I am more scared of the “real” me hurting my prefessional life than the zombie me…how does that make any sense?

By Bruce Prokopets on Jan 31, 2007

Also, the zombie pics are actually me, in case anyone thought otherwise.

RE: Jeremy, as far as Jonestown that also comes back to one individual manipulating the crowd after dissecting their conversations. Eavesdrop on your audience, regurgitate their “wisdom” back at them to establish authority, create false intimacy to gain trust, manipulate the crowd for personal gain, and then when your bored just give them koolaid and forget it ever happened.

By Bruce Prokopets on Jan 31, 2007

It was a joke, Bruce. But i wouldn’t mind seeing you in your bedroom, so I can “size” you up.

I’m a Socialist ganja-smoking wild man who doesn’t even comb his hair, and all my clients are rich Republicans, but they like my business style–I’m honest.

i guess I give them what they need.

By Vince Williams on Jan 31, 2007

Hey Vince, so now it a joke eh? That must be really convenient for you. You start this dialogue with me and when you get bored you just turn it all into a joke. You’re just like everyone else. No one loves me. Time to write a song…

By Bruce Prokopets on Jan 31, 2007

I hope you’re joking too. I’m just a guy who likes to goof around. Wanna date?

By Vince Williams on Jan 31, 2007

Crowds will get you Windows. Perfect!

Oh, put a shirt on. I can’t explain away your nakedness on my computer.

By Jack on Jan 31, 2007

A gay man who doesn’t comb his hair? Now I know you’re just making shit up.

By jvon on Jan 31, 2007

Jvon, damn right I make shit up. But you’re out of the loop if you think fashionable gay (or straight) guys comb their hair.

I have several pairs of jeans with stains and spots on them that I earned honestly. Funnily eough, they’re now high fashion. People pay a couple hundred bucks to get the same look for pants that I paid 25 bucks for.

And they say I’m gay.

By Vince Williams on Jan 31, 2007

Next you’ll tell me you don’t like Madonna.

By jvon on Feb 1, 2007

Oh and yes I am totally out of the loop. Loren and I have the same hairdresser. (She doesn’t like either of us, obviously.)

By jvon on Feb 1, 2007

wow, i’m thoroughly depressed by this post. well, not the post so much as being excluded from that enormous, never-ending list of categories. clearly it’s time to start my own blog.

By meanguy on Feb 1, 2007

Hey I didn’t rate a tag either. I’m taking it as a compliment though, since all this social media stuff is bullshit anyway.

By jvon on Feb 1, 2007

Jvon,

I hate Madonna, I dress sloppy, and I don’t own a thong. I look kinda rough if I don’t shave for a couple of days. I talk like Clint Eastwood on a bad day. Femme gays usually hate me. And if you were talking smack like this here I’d kick your ass and celebrate with some scotch and a fat cigar.

By Vince Williams on Feb 1, 2007

Loren started with a rant about social media and we end up at Madonna. I love it.

Yes Vince, I was kidding too.

By Bruce Prokopets on Feb 1, 2007

Bruce, what about the date?

By Vince Williams on Feb 1, 2007

Vince,

You’re right. If Tom Cruise can be straight, I suppose you can be gay. I’ll take a raincheck on the wrestling match.

By jvon on Feb 1, 2007

Well, Jvon, we could still drink the scotch and smoke the cigars.

By Vince Williams on Feb 1, 2007

Who is Loren Feldman?

Loren Feldman stopped the motor of the world.

By Erik on Feb 1, 2007

Vince: sounds like a plan.

By jvon on Feb 1, 2007

Now THAT’S “social” media.

By Vince Williams on Feb 1, 2007

I’m waiting for you, baby. (I think Loren’s just trying to make me jealous).

By Vince Williams on Feb 1, 2007

Superb, thankyou.

By Nick Wilson on Feb 2, 2007

this post thread has turned into a slow chat room.

this is why “social media” is stupid, but I am a big fan of online collaboration tools, like wikis.

networking just to jabber, isn’t that what the freaking telephone is for?

By vaspers the grate on Feb 14, 2007

Vaspers, why don’t you be my valentine? You’re a poet without a cause, and you’re late to the party.

By Vince Williams on Feb 15, 2007

The video won’t show for me! Waaaah!

So what’s this about the collective unconscience? Is that like the Borg or something? I have never assimilated well.

I don’t personally create video for the masses. I create video for weird ass quirky people who need something fast and interesting to watch and don’t like to sit around waiting for the funny thing to happen.

By Heather Flanagan on Feb 20, 2007

Thank you, Jesus, for Loren Feldman.

By Prokofy Neva on Jun 11, 2007

I’m with Prokofy on this one…

By Jeff McNeill on Jul 16, 2007

Good critique of the fallacies going about on technology that’s integrating with people’s lives.

By Enric on Aug 8, 2007

preach on brathar!

By Thomas Han on Oct 16, 2007

“social media is a fucking… joke.” I said those same words to someone a week ago. Now I’m sad I realized this post is from January. Sigh… one day I’ll be cutting edge

By rdizzle on Oct 24, 2007

put a shirt on you look like a molester

By Your Mother on Feb 27, 2008

hahaha. doubt you’ll read this (and rightly shouldn’t) but good stuff. the whole social web movement has dumbed the web down inestimably over even 10 years ago. just a bunch of fucking no self-esteem kids doing retarded shit for attention.

By Trav on Apr 16, 2008

I know mr. abhay who have done sex with his innocent sister.

I wish someone should scold him.

He stays in india.

His phone no. is,
9422074329

Thanks to all.

By prakash on Apr 24, 2008

I know mr. abhay who have done sex with his innocent sister.

I wish someone should scold him.

He stays in india.

His phone no. is,
9422074329

Thanks to all.

By pandya on Apr 24, 2008